23 teams set for IC14, AFL 9s scrapped

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23 teams set for IC14, AFL 9s scrapped

Authored by: Brett Northey
on Tuesday, February 25 2014 @ 02:08 am ACDT

Disappointing regarding some of the missing teams. Personally, especially Timor Leste and Germany. I thought the Germans were pretty keen this time.

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Brett Northey - Co-founder and Chief Editor of WFN

23 teams set for IC14, AFL 9s scrapped

Authored by: Niels Schønnemann
on Tuesday, February 25 2014 @ 03:45 am ACDT

The cost of going (paid by the players themselves in most cases = 2500-3000euro per players), the time spent (3 weeks) away from work or most of your holiday and the time spent planning and preparing this (as opposed to investing time in development work for your club - both before and after) is a HUGE strain on the leagues - and the general development often takes a step back that season and the next as many need a break after an intense year.

Remember the guys going are also the club and league presidents, VPs, coaches, captains, team leaders, so effort from these roles reduce significantly up to an IC and after. So no wonder particularly leagues with less than 200-300 players either dont attend or only attend every 2nd tournament. Most guys also feel that one tournament is enough and that means most countries need to find a whole new roster for the next IC.

From these 23 teams, I see a least a few dropping out - for the good of the game.

PS: I think the IC is a great tournament and have attended twice myself, but with the above in mind its still impressive the IC keeps growing.

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Brett Northey - Co-founder and Chief Editor of WFN

23 teams set for IC14, AFL 9s scrapped

Authored by: Brett Northey
on Tuesday, February 25 2014 @ 06:26 am ACDT

I think those reasons are good points and well appreciated Niels, although the theory of countries taking a hit the next season is possibly overstated... I think early on we saw a few cases of that such as Spain and accepted the phenomena as real but they were virtually a one club country and I wonder if it's been seen regularly since? Happy to hear feedback.

I could understand it if countries came every second IC, and I'm in favour of it being every 4 years not 3. But I do find it a little strange that Germany (assuming they remain out of IC14) will have never attended any of the ICs. There must be veterans there now that look like going their whole career without a chance to go to the sport's pinnacle international tournament.

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Brett Northey - Co-founder and Chief Editor of WFN

23 teams set for IC14, AFL 9s scrapped

Authored by: Niels Schønnemann
on Tuesday, February 25 2014 @ 01:55 pm ACDT

My experience comes from Denmark and to some extent Europe, so my views will reflect this. Based on this I rarely see anything else than either stagnation or less innovation. Its all about basic operations and getting through the season, so if you view that as a succesfull season, I see why you dont see the hit particularly smaller leagues take. But if we compare maintaining the club numbers one year and attending the IC vs not attending and growing by one club - I would say the ladder is the most succesfull.

Brett, out of curiosity, have you lived overseas and been involved directly on the ground with one of the leagues/countries organising and attending the IC?

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Brett Northey - Co-founder and Chief Editor of WFN

23 teams set for IC14, AFL 9s scrapped

Authored by: Brett Northey
on Tuesday, February 25 2014 @ 09:47 pm ACDT

I sense a disapproving tone Niels. Perhaps I'm too sensitive, but I will briefly defend my credentials even if they are different to say your own.

No I haven't lived overseas doing that work. But I've spent a decade dedicating a large part of my "spare" time (that includes a chunk of what might otherwise be put to useful things like sleeping!) to running this website (which really should be a full time job) purely for the good of the international game (it's up to others whether they judge that successful but we know of the difference we've made in some areas), and a big chunk of that has been monitoring the health of leagues and talking to officials and exchanging ideas etc. Happily the game has outgrown my ability to stay in touch with all the different countries and all the changing faces of officials etc.

So I readily acknowledge I don't know in detail what is happening in each area, hence I asked for feedback. Although at the end of the day living in one or two areas doesn't give anyone a view to what's happening across the whole world.

What I've seen, from afar, is that often after an IC a league is relatively stable in the following year, which in many cases is all that would've happened anyway. But on the upside some players become all the more passionate about the game, and feel part of a greater community, and go back with extra enthusiasm.

I think it really does depend on each individual person and each individual league. But as I said, I too have long thought every 3 years is too much of a drain. So I think we're on the same page.

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Brett Northey - Co-founder and Chief Editor of WFN

23 teams set for IC14, AFL 9s scrapped

Authored by: Harley Vague
on Tuesday, February 25 2014 @ 11:20 pm ACDT

IMO it would not be too difficult to have a quad annual WC and quad annual IC interleaved every two years. Europe could hold a WC and invite the winners of the 49th Parallel Cup, SEAFL and Oceania with the AFL contributing to those select airfares. Could be a great promotion if held in conjuntion with an AFL exhibition game.

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Brett Northey - Co-founder and Chief Editor of WFN

23 teams set for IC14, AFL 9s scrapped

Authored by: Cam Homes
on Tuesday, February 25 2014 @ 11:34 pm ACDT

Cost has and will continue to have a huge bearing on which nations will attend the IC's, regardless of where they are held.

Germany has chosen till now to give the IC's a miss but they have competed in both European Championships to date and also have played some other 'Internationals" in Europe so there are a number of guys who have played for their country. (tho' not at IC level)

The detrimental affect of spending up big to attend an IC nearly always bring the spotlight back on Spain and as someone suggested was due to the fact that it was very early in the formation of AFL Spain (read Madrid, a one club set up).

Probably the ideal situation would be to have the IC's every four years and a regional (as in European Championships) tournament (less costly travel wise) staggered half way in between. The smaller/poorer leagues/nations would be able to make the regional champs their focus for now. The hosts of these regional champs would benefit promotionally as well. Fiji takes a point with hosting under 16's I think. Oceania/South Pacific and Asian (possibly a North and South) Championships should be targets set by the AFL (world ruling body) for the near furure.

The GFC did not help a lot of countries (Croatia had wanted to attend IC11 but it seems cost killed off their attempt. (hope to see them here this time tho) Finland also went home winless after an IC and the inaugural Europe Champs so enthusiasm was hit for a six. Timor Leste (and Spain by the way) were winless (mind Timor Leste lost 2 games by only a goal) so enthusiasm got whacked again with them.

Heaps money spent for no wins :-(

Despite all the above its great to see Solomon Islands, Vanuatu, Indonesia and Pakistan all put their hands up this year as well as Croatia, and good to see Finland having another crack at it. Best of luck to all of them. Just hope that the AFL (world ruling body) is giving them all as much assistance (eg. helping organising travel group concessions, accommodation ditto, etc) as possible.

Qantas looks like they need the customers, AFL use some clout here couldn't they :-)

If all 30 nations attend (guys and gals) that's about at least 2 jumbo jets full coming to Aussie.

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Brett Northey - Co-founder and Chief Editor of WFN

23 teams set for IC14, AFL 9s scrapped

Authored by: Ian Hill
on Tuesday, February 25 2014 @ 02:15 pm ACDT

Have to agree with Niels on all counts and it certainly should be once every four years. I've been out of the loop for a few years but I would think that the net effect of the IC on some leagues would be negative. I would also like to see it held in Europe or North America one year. I can accept that just travelling to Australia with the chance to attend AFL games is a large part of the attraction for many international players, but it would be interesting to see the effect of the travel burden being reversed for some countries.

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Brett Northey - Co-founder and Chief Editor of WFN

23 teams set for IC14, AFL 9s scrapped

Authored by: Jörg Pareigis
on Tuesday, February 25 2014 @ 05:37 pm ACDT

I also think that it is a big ask and am amazed how many dedicated players and officials we have. But if your assumptions are right Niels, shouldn't Germany be "outperforming" all other leagues in Europe by now by far and is that really the case?

And could it not be the case that the IC instead gathers a lot of people around a cause, spreading enthusiasm and creating publicity around the sport, which it would not have received otherwise?

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Brett Northey - Co-founder and Chief Editor of WFN

23 teams set for IC14, AFL 9s scrapped

Authored by: Niels Schønnemann
on Sunday, March 02 2014 @ 02:45 am ACDT

@ Jörg - I agree it can be a common goal and it can be a good thing for some. The national teams in general is a good way of uniting leagues for a common pupose rather than the dividing nature of local competition. Regarding if Germany should be the rocket of growth in Europe by now, it would rather turn the argument around. Where would they be if they had attended? we know its a struggle for them to send full sides to the the Euro Champs. From an outsider, it seems they are making the right decision.

@ Brett - No dissaproving tone - have seen your work on here, but was curious if you had groundwork experience as well. An issue like this is always coming from what experiences you have seen or been around.

Having attended two ICs I like the idea and I agree with others that qualifiers are not whats needed, unless you wanted a higher quality at the IC. From my point of view, the AFL has the following agendas with the IC:

1. Promote to their main stakeholders, that their limited international ressources has been stretched far and wide - and its paying dividends.

2. Asses to themselves what progress they are making with their specific investments (we all know, that its not a fair competition, when certain countries gets their trip paid for/organised)

3. Learning from the attending countries about their challenges

4. The competition itself.

Regarding why the IC is held every 3 years, I think its obvious - from the above agenda, every 4 years makes for fewer cases of the above agenda, and only Europe has a proper local senior championship going, so most other countries only have this to look forward to as proper international competition, so they want as much as possible - and three years suits them. So from everyones perspectives (apart from Europes) every 3 years makes more sense.

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Brett Northey - Co-founder and Chief Editor of WFN

23 teams set for IC14, AFL 9s scrapped

Authored by: Brett Northey
on Sunday, March 02 2014 @ 08:39 am ACDT

@Niels - ok understood.

@Peter - good to see you haven't lost your passion for the 9s.

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Brett Northey - Co-founder and Chief Editor of WFN

23 teams set for IC14, AFL 9s scrapped

Authored by: Harley Vague
on Sunday, March 02 2014 @ 09:21 pm ACDT

Jarren, yes I'd already considered the fact that holding qualifiers could eliminate potential participants and I wasn't seriously proposing it for the IC atm moreover it was directed at lengthing the interval of the IC to four years and creating a WC in the middle. ATM we have the Euro Cup and with a bit of financial help for zone qualifiers you could create a WC. the IC is not going to change in a hurry. Coming to Australia is expensive but most participants see some value in coming to the "spiritual home" of football. If the IC became mobile, then there would be different countries that are travel winners and travel losers, approximating to no nett gain in participating countries, Some countries might drop out because they weren't travelling to the home of football.To balance that, IMO, atm, there is probably more promotional potential in an IC outside of Australia. So it makes sense to me to target the Euro Cup. Yes it requires some funding to bring qualifiers to a WC but it it is a loss less in amount and political fallout in trying to do something for all the IC teams. I mention the Euro Cup because they are becoming increasingly successful however it could be a world 9s tournament held every four years interleaved with the IC. The irony is, that because of the cost in travelling (to europe)you could invite Aussie teams to participate(and not be flooded with responses). Personally, I'd like to see IC matches played around Australia but this simple change would greatly increase costs in most cases. I believe it is incredibly important for Australians to make a noise about this event.not only to generate some financial underwriting but some emotional underwriting as well.

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Brett Northey - Co-founder and Chief Editor of WFN

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