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Oceania score Day 1 win in NSW State U16 Championships
Authored by: Rory Slater on Monday, May 02 2011 @ 03:52 pm ACST

Brett

With all respect, I don't believe I am losing or winning anything here really and that I punched in 'Mark' instead of 'Michael' is hardly cause to render my sentiment baseless.  Your response probably is as much about pedantic hair splitting as mine might be 'sledging' as you like to put it -  a bit of the pot calling the kettle black on your part I believe.

Again, you contradict yourself Brett.  Why can't Kiwis support there local Australian Footy comps and be satisfied with that then?  Why wouldn't the nations capital want a piece of the AFL pie, given the powerful symbology that the indigenous code evokes and the pedigree and loyalty this region, along with other Australian football demographics, have provided the game historically, remembering NZ has not?   You invest much in advocating on behalf of international countries in particular NZ and at the expense of local options, which is evident by your inference that Canberra is not worthy of AFL elite status, while NZ is, which is insulting as already expressed.

Aside from your banker type analogies that promote NZ to growing the 'brand' the reality is there exists NO criteria that favors this country ahead of Canberra and I would argue that the commercial one you have touted is hardly convincing, especially when you consider the GC and GWS experiments are likely to take decades to be realised if at all -  so any NZ foray on the AFL's part would make these current challenges pale in comparison. 

Wellington is no larger than Canberra, which is as commercially viable if not more so than the NZ capital.  It's proximity to both Sydney and Melbourne is closer than NZ and despite being smaller than Auckland it has the distinct advantage of being an Australian city, the capital, possessing an inherent culture for the game unlike the hostile backwater across the ditch.

NZ's population is predominately to  heavy so Auckland is the more likely base I suppose however, NZ still small presents challenges in respect of distances as well as stadia, so there is no guarantee that a market on an AFL scale and criteria exists there, ahead of the options available in this country,especially.  Conversely, Canberra has a population of 380k with the potential to draw on a regional population of approx 700k including the footy heartland of the MIA.  The region actually has a long standing affinity and active relationship with our game as well as being close to Sydney and Melbourne.

While you use Canberra's 'catholic' sporting culture as a negative in it's ability to support an AFL side you contradict yourself by talking up NZ, which boasts the most parochial Union culture on the planet. The NZ sporting market currently struggles to support the elite codes represented through respective Australian Leagues in cities like Auckland and Wellington. These include Soccer, Union, League, Basketball, Netball, all of which are as vulnerable to market forces if not more so than Canberra.

It is clear that as much as I come across anti NZ to you (which is more about having the national capital acknowledged and represented at the most elite tier this cultural institution offers and NZ's ability to piggy back on our sporting leagues at the expedience of local demos) you most certainly come across sanctimoniously altruistic yet anti Canberra.  

Perhaps you should be putting your money where your mouth is Brett, by promoting the re location of the struggling Crowes and Port Adelaide to a NZ city as much as deny the nations capitals right of passage in this respect.  I mean Adelaide have two AFL brands, Soccer and Basketball with Union and League looking to expand there in the near future, so why shouldn't Adelaide be equally altruistic and content in giving up one or both of these to poor old NZ and PNG, while supporting their local SANFL?

I will be attending the mercenary NZ Bulldogs final hoorah, v the Swannies at Manuka footy oval this Saturday and hope that the gate again attracts a capacity crowd, i.e. 14G, which is larger than many of the gates Union and League attracted in NZ last weekend.  Given a larger stadia at Manuka I assure you our game would regularly pull gates of 15 to 20k from the get go Brett, weather permitting of course.

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Oceania score Day 1 win in NSW State U16 Championships
Authored by: Brett Northey on Monday, May 02 2011 @ 06:14 pm ACST

Yes I couldn't resist nitpicking your post because they appeared to me to be increasingly wild and woolly.

Not sure what you mean by  Canberra's 'catholic' sporting culture.  Being the nation's small capital my understanding is that it has a high turnover of people coming from all around Australia, including many from Rugby League backgrounds, and if you somehow start to win over them or their children, they may well be gone back to Sydney etc.  So I think it's a tough gig with much smaller payoff than NZ.  But it still deserves support, which it gets through AFL NSW/ACT programs and now GWS - much more than the much larger Auckland gets.  If you don't believe in expansion as a good business proposition then don't hold out your hand for support from the same financial coffers.  We can go back to having the various state leagues only and the VFL run itself into the ground, and Rugby League can become the number one national sport.

You say I'm choosing NZ over Canberra.  I can't see how Canberra could support an AFL team, therefore there is no choice, they are independent issues.  I have a strong interest in one, and a mild interest in the other.  Hopefully other Canberrans can see this is not personal, I only argue "against" Canberra here as the issue is being (artifically in my opinion) linked to NZ.  If anything the strongest link to another region is GWS and whether Canberra/ACT wants to be associated with it.

I say you are as much anti-NZ as you are pro-Canberra because of numerous comments you've made in this thread, in emails and elsewhere.  I guess the Canberra issue allows the NZ issue to be presented by you more "innocently".

For interest, according to http://stats.rleague.com/afl/crowds/vn_manuka_oval.html the average crowd is 11367 over the past 13 years for 1 to 3 games per year.  Looks like true capacity is about 15000.

Putting on my Crows supporter beanie, thanks for the offer you are welcome to have Port Adelaide.  Incidentally Port have averaged about 25000 per game at home over the last few years and are very much struggling financially (do you think they'd do better in Canberra?).  Adelaide has had 1 negative financial result last year, the first for many years if I recall correctly.  They averaged 36k to home games last year, down from a typical average of mid 40k in the years before that.

Should I be promoting Canberra?  I don't think so.  I'm here promoting international footy.  If I was not promoting international footy then I wouldn't be on this website.  Why should I put my "money where my mouth is" and promote Canberra, when that is not where my interest lies?  No offence to Canberra, and I'd be happy for them to one day get and sufficiently support an AFL club, but that's not where my interest lies.  Perhaps you can pay me to spend my spare time doing it?

Are we making any progress on this thread?

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Brett Northey - Co-founder and Chief Editor of WFN
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Oceania score Day 1 win in NSW State U16 Championships
Authored by: Cam Homes on Monday, May 02 2011 @ 08:21 pm ACST

Shees!!!!!!!!!! Twisted Knickers I say!

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Oceania score Day 1 win in NSW State U16 Championships
Authored by: Brett Northey on Monday, May 02 2011 @ 08:33 pm ACST

Cam, what your post lacks in eloquence is compensated for by its clarity and succinctness.   8)

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Brett Northey - Co-founder and Chief Editor of WFN
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Oceania score Day 1 win in NSW State U16 Championships
Authored by: Cam Homes on Monday, May 02 2011 @ 08:55 pm ACST

Gee! Thanks Brett.

Flattery will get you everywhere..

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