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Thursday, September 19 2019 @ 09:24 am ACST

Folau, Michael not eligible for IC11

International Cup 2011The AFL has confirmed to worldfootynews.com that two high profile footballers will not be eligible to appear at the International Cup in 2011. While it would be good publicity to have them in the International Cup the AFL feels exemptions for these players would not be fair to opposition countries.

Israel Folau's development with GWS continues in a positive direction as he has been kicking goals for the club recently in a move to the forward line, but he will not be eligible for Tonga (he is of Tongan descent but born and raised in NSW and Queensland).

Three time AFL premiership player, veteran Mal Michael, was reported last week to have dominated the ruck for Aberfeldie Park in the EDFL. He was born in PNG but mostly raised in Australia. Mal has closely followed the PNG Mosquitoes but also does not fit the International Cup criteria, as specified below.
8.2 Eligibility

(a) A Player is eligible for selection by a League if:

(i) the Player was predominantly resident in the country of the League between 10 and 16 years of age, subject to the qualification in sub-clause 8.2(b); This does not apply for the women’s division for the 2011 International Cup (sub clauses 8.2 (a) & (b) do still apply)

(ii) the Player is a citizen of the country of the League at the time when the Competition is conducted, subject to the qualification in sub-clause 8.2(b); and

(iii) the Player is not under suspension in that Player’s local competition during the period of the Competition.

(iv) The player is included in the squad provided under Regulation 8.1.

(b) The AFL may, on a case by case basis, waive the eligibility requirements contained in sub-clause 8.2(a) and (b) if it is satisfied that a Player is a bona fide resident in the country of the League and his participation would be in the best interests of the Competition. Submissions in this regard must be made by lodging the Player Eligibility form attached as Appendix II before the commencement of the Competition.

8.3 Final Team Selection

(a) Each team shall provide to the Competition Manager a final list of players no later than the commencement time of the Team Managers meeting preceding the event.

(b) A player not listed in the squad provided in accordance with Regulation 8.1 shall be ineligible to participate.

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Folau, Michael not eligible for IC11 | 13 comments | Create New Account
The following comments are owned by whomever posted them. This site is not responsible for what they say.
Folau, Michael not eligible for IC11
Authored by: tinka13 on Wednesday, June 22 2011 @ 11:58 pm ACST

Thank God they used common sense. At the last count there were dozens and dozens of overseas players playing professional AFL in Australia. For now the International Cup must remain an amatuer competition.

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Folau, Michael not eligible for IC11
Authored by: Troy Thompson on Thursday, June 23 2011 @ 07:28 am ACST

I am not sure it is strictly an issue of amateur vs professional.  There will be a number of guys playing who are paid to play footy whether it be in country leagues, suburban leagues, state leagues or former AFL listed players.    It is more a question of legitimate eligibility and the possibility that you end up with an IC champion that has questionable exemptions made that are unfair to other teams. 

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Folau, Michael not eligible for IC11
Authored by: Harley Vague on Thursday, June 23 2011 @ 10:36 am ACST

This is a really straight forward situation and rightly so.

A player cannot be a product of Australia .To be eligible to play for a country a player must have played AR in that country .That requirement is refined further as to be his formative years not his latter years .

What if the AFL suggest  to overseas imports that they have a tryout in a local league (however short) before coming to Australia ? All of sudden the Irish team is AFL reserves standard .

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Folau, Michael not eligible for IC11
Authored by: Troy Thompson on Thursday, June 23 2011 @ 11:19 am ACST

I think we may see Aisake oh'Ailpin and Conor Meredith play for Ireland (if they want to) in this IC though (and a number of other Irishmen who may have never played Aussie rules in Ireland).

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Folau, Michael not eligible for IC11
Authored by: Cam Homes on Thursday, June 23 2011 @ 11:56 am ACST

Did not oh'Ailpin and Meredith come from the GAA. If they did then they wouldn't be eligible because they've learned all their Aussie rules in Australia not the ARFLI in Ireland.

There are, I believe, some Irishmen who did learn their Aussie rules in Ireland who now live and play here who would be eligible however, and I think they are on the ARFLI's radar to play in the IC.

Cam.

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Folau, Michael not eligible for IC11
Authored by: Troy Thompson on Thursday, June 23 2011 @ 12:10 pm ACST

Cam, read their situation in terms of the eligibility rules above.  Nothing says they have to have played the game in Ireland as far as I see.  Just not predominantly in Australia between 10-16 is the intention and they were obviously in Ireland even if not playing Aussie rules.

By the same token Pyke and McNamara could play for Canada and US respectively if they wanted to play and their clubs let them.

I am pretty sure last time around it was confirmed that Brad Moran would be eligible for GB if he wanted to play and the Crows allowed it.

 

 

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Folau, Michael not eligible for IC11
Authored by: Brett Northey on Thursday, June 23 2011 @ 01:19 pm ACST

Yes I think Troy is correct in his reading of the rules.  And yes I think Moran was eligible however we contacted AFL Great Britain (or maybe it was called the BARFL then) and they said they were only interested in guys who had played in the UK.  So eligible - yes, available - probably not, required - no.

This all continues to be an area that has clear rules but the ability to vary them or make exceptions, and which will become increasingly difficult as the IC evolves.  As more juniors get involved and AFL talent ID improves, we could easily see a 12 year old play locally for 1 year, then get offered a scholarship to play in Australia and if they go well get it renewed each year.  Suddenly you have a gun 17 year old who by the above criteria would not be eligible for their country, whereas I believe they should be able to play.  NZ's young ruckman Kurt Heatherly is now Australian-based thanks to Hawthorn.  If he'd arrived a year or so earlier I suspect he would technically become ineligible for NZ.

As a parochial South Australian I think of the irony that this international impact all comes from "the Wayne Carey rule".  For those that don't know, South Australia beat Victoria in the State-of-Origin match in 1992.  SA had the likes of Carey, Modra and Kernahan in the forward line.  Carey was well on his way to becoming arguably the greatest centre-half-forward of all time.

The eligibility rule read:  "A player (is) to be tied to the state or territory where he was first registered at age 15".  For Carey that was SA.  The AFL then changed the rule in 1993 to:  "A player (is) to be tied to the state or territory where he resided for the majority of the time between ages 10 and 17."  That neatly shifted him to NSW.  That rule has remained (a recent example was in the All-Stars vs Victoria match in 2008 when Adam Goodes starred for Victoria, after initally thinking he'd be playing for his home state of SA).  And now we see it applied internationally.  Not saying it is wrong - whatever formula is used there will be players that will end up misplaced because of it.

The other issue is that excellent players are already starting to move to semi-pro and pro Australian teams and some of them will not play in IC11.  So the standard has a bit of a ceiling on it, therefore the chances of it growing into a well attended pinnacle event is somewhat limited.  These things will come to a head over the next 5 to 20 years, depending on how quickly the sport grows.

---
Brett Northey - Co-founder and Chief Editor of WFN
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Folau, Michael not eligible for IC11
Authored by: Cam Homes on Thursday, June 23 2011 @ 01:42 pm ACST

Troy

Yes, the wording does not appear to rule anybody out, but I believe that the intent is that players learned the game in those formative years 10-16 on their own country.

Take the clause about  a players participation "being in the best interests of the competition. If the intent is for the players to be bonifide residents of the participating nation and therefore become Australian Rules footballers representing their country then I believe all the participating nations who are taking part would consider that these players(never been a registered player or even played footy in their home country) would not be allowed to play because it is not in the best interest of the IC concept or competition.

Brett.  I don't know if the rules that "state of origin" are even part of the IC eligiblity rules but the intent was the same. I believe that's why the change was made that you mentioned. So that Carey couldn't play for South Australia. He wouldn't be playing for Victoria but more importantly he wouldn't be playing against them.

Lets's face it, who won the most State of Origin matches? :-)

Cam

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Folau, Michael not eligible for IC11
Authored by: Brett Northey on Thursday, June 23 2011 @ 03:16 pm ACST

Cam, I think the State of Origin rule (Wayne Carey rule) is virtually the same, so I assume it was just lifted from SOO for use in the IC.

Regarding the clause about a player's participation being in the best interests of the game, I think that section only applies if the player is initially ineligible and looking for an exemption.  So by default I think someone raised in Country X from 10 - 16 years but who first starts playing in Australia as an adult is indeed still eligible for Country X if they are still a citizen of that country.

---
Brett Northey - Co-founder and Chief Editor of WFN
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Folau, Michael not eligible for IC11
Authored by: Aaron Richard on Thursday, June 23 2011 @ 04:41 pm ACST

It's important that the IC emphasises the development of players who were legitimately developed outside Australia.  But there are quite a few precedents of players who came to Australia as adults, played club footy, then represented their home country without having played there.

David Stynes (younger brother of former Demons Jim and Brian) played for Ireland at the IC 2002, from memory I think he even might have been named player of the tournament.  He came to Australia as an adult, but I don't think he'd ever played in Ireland.  His home club was listed as the Whitehorse Pioneers, in Melbourne's Eastern FL.

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Folau, Michael not eligible for IC11
Authored by: Cam Homes on Thursday, June 23 2011 @ 05:21 pm ACST

Did David Stynes ever play AFL/VFL footy or just today's version of the VFL?

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Folau, Michael not eligible for IC11
Authored by: Aaron Richard on Thursday, June 23 2011 @ 10:22 pm ACST

Definitely never played AFL/VFL.  I'm not 100% sure, but I don't think he played any VFL/VFA either.

From memory, Brian Stynes played only about 3 senior games for Melbourne, but quite a few seasons for... Port Melbourne maybe?

David I don't think played above Eastern FL, but I could be wrong.

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Folau, Michael not eligible for IC11
Authored by: Aaron Richard on Thursday, June 23 2011 @ 10:45 pm ACST

Google suggests that David never played higher than the EFL or SFL, though he did play for Ireland in both the  2002 and 2005 ICs.  He is currently playing coach of the Moorabbin Kangas in Melbourne's Southern FL.

Brian returned to Ireland after failing to gain a regular spot with the Dees.

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